What do you advice your fielders?
What do you do differently?
Do you do anything to try to determine (ahead of time) the likelihood of a suicide squeeze?
Do you ever practice this?
Or, are you of the opinion that a well-executed suicide squeeze is basically indefensible? The inherent risk taken by the offense is defense enough, since failure results a good percentage of times.
David Emerling
Memphis, TN
The sign is given, the batter and runner both acknowledge the play is on. Runner breaks for home when pitchers landing foot hits the ground. Batter squares late and if the ball is anywhere fair and on the ground about the only defense is the do or die shovel or scoop play from the pitcher to the plate.
If on the other hand you have a hunch the squeeze is on, I have heard of some different philosophies:
1. Pitchout wide.
2. Pitchout Up and In to RH batter to get him to move.
3. Bounce the pitch in to home at the edge of the grass cut out.
4. If you have LH pitcher on the mound. (They can't see the runner as well as a RH)
There are probably some other aspects to this play as well. FYI We practiced it last year w/ 15 yr olds before a state tourney. Used it in the championship game against a LH pitcher. It was used early in the game 3rd or 4th inning I think and our guys pulled it off nicely. Their 3rd baseman was so surprised, he didn't even pick up the ball and throw to 1st. It definitely gave us momentum and helped us go on to win the game.
If a suicide squeeze is a possibility then at least fake a throw to third and see if the hitter, runner, or coach tips his hand. The best defense against a squeeze is to take the element of surprise away from the opposition; they either will scrap their plans or, at the very least, will be extra cautious in executing the play.
If your opponent makes one of the most common mistakes teams make when executing a squeeze- the runner on third leaves early- you will likely pick him off and get him in a rundown. If they commit the other most common mistake- the batter squares too early- you have taken the element of surprise away from them. Next pitch (IMO) will be high and tight to a RH hitter (clears him out of the way so the catcher can make a play on the incoming runner) or a very wide pitchout to a LH hitter.
This is one of the situations where good coaching can really have a major impact on the game. The ability to read the other coach's mind and be aware of the situation is crucial to not being caught by surprise with a squeeze.
Double Jeopardy Question:
Pitcher on the rubber in the wind-up position getting his signal from the catcher. Suddenly the runner on 3rd breaks for home. The pitcher had not yet even begun his windup. The shocked pitcher simply throws the ball to the catcher without stepping off the rubber.
Legal?
David Emerling
Memphis, TN
Can I answer the double jeopardy question? I know. I know.
As far as the suicide question, if they execute and you haven't guessed it--you're in trouble. I know some people that just won't believe it, but it's like saying, "How do you keep a guy from reaching first when he hits an uncatchable line drive to the OF?"
I do think fake moves to third not only may make the other team show their hand, but sometimes deters the other coach from calling it. Just the thought that the defense is thinking about a squeeze worries a coach that he might take the bat out of his team's hands by running a squeeze into a pitchout.
MikeB, I can think of no good reason how throwing a pitch in the ground helps the defense. It is easier for the batter to hit a bounced ball than it is for a catcher to catch it (while being screened by the batter attempting to bunt) and then make a tag. It is legal to hit (or bunt) a ball after it hits the ground. If someone told you otherwise, they are wrong. David will back me up, I am sure.
--jim
PS Double jeopardy answer is LEGAL. It is not a balk, it is a pitch. And a legal one as long as the catcher stays in the catcher's box (ie. no catcher's interference). If the catcher receives the ball on the plate, it is a catcher's balk. The batter gets first and the runner gets home.
--jim
[ding!] [ding!] [ding!]
Judges?
We have a WINNER! Yes, this is not a balk and is perfectly legal. Your comments regarding the restrictions on the catcher are also true.
This is a pitch. The batter is even free to offer at ball and hit it.
There is no requirement for the pitcher to windup before delivering.
There is no requirement for the pitcher to deliver the ball using the same routine as has been doing all game.
From the windup position, in order to deliver a legal pitch the pitcher only needs to ...
1. Have legal contact with the pitching rubber.
2. Be facing the batter.
3. Step toward the batter while delivering the ball while making one continuous motion.
That's it!
In fact, it would be perfectly legal to deliver the ball underhanded just like they do in church league adult softball. The 3 criteria would all still apply and, therefore, it would be a legal baseball delivery.
Coachjim, for your correct answer you win a year's supply of Turtle Wax.
* * *
SUPER Double Jeopardy Question.
While on the rubber in the set position and while still getting his sign from the catcher, the runner from third makes an early break for the plate. The pitcher has not yet gone through his "stretch" routine and has not yet even brought his hands together. The stunned pitcher simply throws the ball to the plate without ever having stepped off the rubber.
In every respect, this is the identical situation as the first question with one exception, the pitcher is getting his signal while assuming the SET position as opposed to the WINDUP position.
Legal?
David Emerling
Memphis, TN
It is a trick question.
It would be legal if the pitcher had assumed the "SET" position. However, according to your description the pitcher was NOT in the SET position. According to the description, the pitcher "has not even brought his hands together." In order to be in a legal set position, the pitcher must come set with the ball in both hands in front of the body--and the pitcher has to pause in that set position.
Balk.
--jim
The "set position" is not necessarily once the pitcher has come "set".
The rules describe only TWO legal ways for the pitcher to initially engage the rubber; the SET or WINDUP position.
From the WINDUP position, the pitcher needs only to deliver the ball to the batter. He does have to bring his hands together but no pause is necessary. No preliminary action is necessary. Just step and throw. Legal!
From the SET position, the pitcher must FIRST bring his hands together and come to a "discernible stop" before delivering to the batter. That is a requirement that does not exist from the WINDUP position.
* * *
So, going back to the first Double Jeopardy question, actually, it *would* be a balk if the pitcher never brings his hands together. But usually the pitcher will do this just as part of the routine of throwing the ball - even if his intent is NOT to pitch. So it would STILL be legal.
These are very difficult calls for an umpire because it all happens so suddenly.
OBR 8.01 describes the two positions.
David Emerling
Memphis, TN
This message was edited by Memphis on 4-12-06 @ 4:43 PM
If you read closely, you will see that the "set" position *is* necessarily when the pitcher comes to paused position with the hands together in front of the body. The pitcher may not necessarily go into the stretch (ie. he may step on the pitcher's plate with both hands together--but he would have to step on, pause, and then pitch with no stretch).
It doesn't matter for your question. If the pitcher's hands were not together when the runner broke, I doubt the pitcher would come to a "discernable stop" before throwing home which would be a balk.
--jim
That's true but, still, there are only two legal ways a pitcher can initially engage the rubber with the intent to pitch. Once he has legally engaged the rubber, whether with the intent to pitch from the WINDUP or SET position, he must always bring his hands together prior to delivering to the batter; the only difference being that no pause is required from the WINDUP position.
Pitching regulations can be very complex, at times. High School pitching regulations are much more complex than those unde the Official Baseball Rules.
David Emerling
Memphis, TN
If the batter doesn't telegraph his intent ... and the runner doesn't break too early ... and the batter puts down a halfway decent bunt ... YOU'RE SCREWED.
The only thing you can do is try to discourage the other team from executing a suicide squeeze.
If you think the situation is ripe for a suicide squeeze, you can have your pitcher execute a move toward 3rd (much like a left-handed pitcher does toward 1st) and simply NOT throw the ball. It really doesn't even matter if your 3rd baseman is covering.
Sometimes the runner will break if the suicide is on. If not, the mere fact that you executed this move provides much discouragement to the 3rd base coach in executing a suicide squeeze.
Another good tactic is to execute a pitchout. But if you guess wrong and your pitcher falls behind in the count, your pitcher is eventually going to have to throw a strike which will be very buntable.
One other thing: The pitcher can come set and stay set for a very long time. Sometimes the batter will get antsy and show bunt too soon.
By the way - this is fairly old thread. Did you use the search engine to resurrect it?
David Emerling
Memphis, TN
This message was edited by Memphis on 6-4-06 @ 6:57 PM
I have been meaning to clarify "Bouncing the pitch in from the edge of the grass cutout" It was an option if the offense gave the squeeze away too early and the pitcher was about to release the ball. It was definitely an "on the fly adjustment" by the pitcher and he would throw a long hop into the catcher. Our pitchers in college practiced it a bit as an option. Can't say we ever did it. But I would think it could throw off the batter just enough.